Some of these pages, from the 4th of oct onward, have this table's background colour, and (B9D66D) for the linktexts, <BODY text=#000000 vLink=#cc33cc aLink=#ffff00 link=#b9d66d bgColor=#390039><FONT face="Helvetica, Arial" color=white> --  'side bar' frame removed,  --  3 (occasionally 4) newswire pages consolidated into one (73K).the (browncoloured) bar and white title text therein are untouched).  ----  The mirror here has 2 subdirectories to some pages lacking the root URL (as yet), iow: DIY link target practice opportunities: /pre21st-tinker-clicks ( from the 21nd of sept. backward; 28 pages so far) and a similar bunch in /post27sep-tinker-clicks which became neccesary since the occasional dropping of the root URL until I decided to put some more work into this mirror (mind my manners): 
Suspected reasons of the need for a rapids-avoiding rather than r-running mirror: Too few slowpokes to be considerate of (since I noticed the machine in the city hall gets stuff easily enough even during peak traffic intensity periods). So, .. . .why are there no links to mirrors such as mine on the blank 'error' and 'overload' page yet??????. Cause it don't even show during congestion?   ---  Another 'sugquestion': simply post the succesfully uploaded item-numbers on the front page, that should allow people to bypass the newswire pages  . .. .(of course once the items themselves become congested my sort of mirroring becomes useless). Another wonder I had is about the way the nwp-numbers change. Does that take a lot of compuwer juice?



I posted the following on the 22nd; 77215: It is not easy, specially for a poet, to be modest, but it should be more difficult to be as immodest as many poets have contrived to be -- James Stephens, in along letter from Paris to Steve Mckenna 1913   -------     Da Berlin Wall is a relatively innocuous divider compared to lines of division less buffer puff bulky and hard to budge. The double edgedness, the truely frontal activity is reserved for sharper lines. Cultural relativity can become one such when it 'contraccentrates' to near invisibility while getting stronger, longer, active and unstable enough to cut themselves swaths of confirmational debris. How do these mass miseries move with such unpredictable meta(- and dia)bolism? During relatively quiet and unpolarized times folk emphasize sameness on one side and difference on the other side of the distance divide, all the better the wider and consequently more unanimously anonymous to either side they remain. Of course a related function of the word points to where the stuckage ('stewcage') sticks: close relatives are near inescapable much of the time. Inevitable and not just relatively.  ---------- The Berlin, Chinese and Wailing Walls are got into focus simply enough compared to the more and more (sloppy n floppily shipshoppy worn, overtolerantly rattling, erratic yet fearsomely sharp and  jetstream like whipsnap eruption building bulges and) widening sweeps of cultural chasms once 'bridged',specially cause and when the latter means poisoning and parasitically metabolizing each other's space, trees, oil, services and a whole host of other stuff the perpetrator has to somehow justify his takings for and usually with. They're pratically identified with, that is to say, smothered in the stuff yet have no eye or use for but never enough of it; this process prices authenticity out of all markets but that of the super rich who are then reduced to simulating it. Not infrequently, a coarse and callous invasion will be justified by a not quite past grudge, a nursed hurt,  etc. 'Plowing the dark' indeed (just finished a poetic pill by that title - RPowers).   -------- Instead of the softy ways which pull and stay away from each other {more than mix- n - overflowing or at full midtide swing flooding each other in unambiguously one way fashion} allowing (memebrainy) membraney, slow precipitation and sedimental accretion, the cusp of tide turmoil turns treacherous when balance of such graduation (inquisitiveness with underlying tonic, base, bass and bottom line of tenderly tentacled yet most (durable=) feminine ((the cute who do and need not commute, those who are cute cause they won't neoliberally (((but perhaps with mojo pool, P2P, linux, etc))) compute)) and distance modifying dominion) never seems to get less lost. - The longer the term the more terminal the longing, so act now to make the same defer --xxx-- samer - famer - claimer - blamer - tamer - namer - lamer - aimer - all a bombs was meant to and does be unless we disallow them to just do it. ----- To open a wide and diffuse playing field for itself is the least of less opportunist cultural endeavors; the ones I tried to scout and stake out are waiting in the wings for air time.    --------   core action (english) by piet 9:17am Mon Oct 22 '01  A few of the many unintentional (yet bordering on blatant carelessness if not time constraint) bloops corrected (and integrated above)

78435 be wary of Arab . .. .(opinionjournal again); my (ninth) comment: Read some B Fell to make your head spin --- Or Atwater for that matter (I just placed 2 quotes on, they show that basically there are none such things as races, just variations on a theme.   All the more burden to fall on habits, if there are no races and consequently no bad races we can purrhips (finnally) open our eyes wide enough to the (when trained, instantly apparant and/since plainly reflected) badness of certain habits ('dabism'. vs badhood anybody?) Allow me to attempt freeing some forces. Join the fun and set some force free for the fineash fadle finesse today.

78576 Last post for a while: Your mirror man wants to pass the baton It really works! Well, to me own utter and complete satisfaction (get to choose colours) anyways. Recommend it to anyone who has the energy to complain. In a way tis a failed experiment since there would have to be mention of these sort of things on the overload page. Today is the last day/chance for an up to date visit; I am taking a break; so long. Ps: subst. 2 for 1 and you have 'm all for the 26th (and yare wellcome to the full month ahead of it, almost all items between sept 22 and oct 26 can be found).
78967 Come get the last 24 hour newswire mirrors while they're crunchy.  by preport(z)eurpiet -- OK, off for real now; hope it served not just me. Time will tell. Ps: no article. /indymedia-newswire-mirror/26-10-01-1.htm 
(substitute 2 for one and find the second part) 
I forgot to add the following: Cock n king, organ n empire;
they act much the same and come to the same thing 
(William Irwin Thompson in his latest book)

Been great adding to these files for the past year but I am off for at least a break from and perhaps, who knows, a break with them.  Yall are welcome to take over the mirroring of course. Solo ng.
'ang on, got time for a partin' shot:
25-10prfr.htm (206K): transcription of Chomsky's recent MIT lecture printer friendlied (and you know by now; no place offers compacter version that your very own preporter piet) ----------- Items via nettime: War on Terrorism: Observer special -------  Fighting Islam's Ku Klux Klan - by Kanan Makiya, The Observer,Oct 7 -------- Interview with Robert Fisk at Beirut Airport in Lebanon ----- ------- (Passion and Reason by Umberto Eco translated by Kermit Snelson(diff. (?) version by the Guardian)

OK, I am back (12th of november) after a two week break:
Lemme first move the now outdated stuff that lived and evolved at the top of this file for a month or so:
My site (and the mirror too of course, unless, as I hope, others 'get the idea'; 78157 seems to suggest the need is ((still)) there, nobody mentions my mirror, not even savvy ChuckO <<musta bin too hard on 'im>> chuckle chuckle) will cease growing (but not on all courageous enough to visit)  while I try wean myself from a straight 10 year screenfeed soon.
So, a break from and praps with: 'updated every day but the sun one';  about every damn thing under it + disdained (but ever fluffable?) stuffables from it the light n bright sight of shady groves future n shady groves past long since begun to fire imagination and long since begun to get undone.
A repeat:

/indymedia-newswire-mirror   (international  pages) (minus thumbnail pics if any) - Done every (mainland euro)morning between 7.30 - 10.30 AM since 17th of sept, <item number 64815>). Links to almost all items from the 22nd of september forward; allowing for date slippage a number of numbering formulae is used in all 3 directories: d-m-y-newswirepage number like so: /26-10-01-1.htm (through 8 or 1abc2abc.htm).
 See the bottom of this file for more details (and my lead up to it all in:  /2001/indy13.htm
  Some of these pages, from the 4th of oct onward, have this table's background colour, and (B9D66D) for the linktexts, <BODY text=#000000 vLink=#cc33cc aLink=#ffff00 link=#b9d66d bgColor=#390039><FONT face="Helvetica, Arial" color=white> --  'side bar' frame removed,  --  3 (occasionally 4) newswire pages consolidated into one (73K).the (browncoloured) bar andwhite title text therein are untouched).  ----  The mirror here has 2 subdirectories to some pages lacking the root URL (as yet), iow: DIY link target practice opportunities: /pre21st-tinker-clicks (from the 21nd of sept. backward; 28 pages so far) and a similar bunch in /post27sep-tinker-clicks which I thought neccesary since Indyans are switching between machines with and without the root URL until I deciding to put some more work into this mirror (and mind my manners). 

The mirror will become progressively less fresh; hope it ages well. Not absolutely but relatively speaking this is the last day to see 'today's':
Today's 2 files are the last for now; here's 1 (51K)

86220 crimethinc olympia Wash parsin gives away the secret conveyance trick; I go: Put encryption on a par with terrorism where it belongs. Think terrorist vs 'freedom fighter'. I mean, all they both do is fight, right? Those that fight dirty dirty their rights and fighting against dirty fighters is like warding off a shower with your bare hands. Better move to the desert and escape all those feminine assaults.    Same sorta ways-n-means ever served needs of fanaticism: cut to the chase, polarize, clearcut, desertify, fundamentate, windowdress, abscond, repress, sneak and slide back into the black beneath it all. Dichotomies, binaries, simplifications yinyan deprived of permutations, colours spinning out, to hard to retain identity. I think it was Goethe who discovered a way out of the white/black thinking/perceiving, you stick em on a wheel and spin to the right rpm for couleur to appear. There is at least one toy windmill company who reproduce a derivative effect, the colour of 4 rainbows on a wheel on a stick turn white at the right windgust velocity.

87907  .......hours with Genua footage reminded me of the prudence the vastly outnumbered police practised. They gave the above suggested (but barely in bud let alone meriting the appelation: prospective) self policing policy a chance of 2 full days (!!!) before  reaching the arguably justifiable conclusion that the vast majority was implicated, complicit, offered shelter, subterfuge, cover and condonement for the various BB 'principles' embodying terrorist actions (let's not get into how much bleakblockheadedness gives more fanatically terroristic tactic appliers any ideas and encouragement; the fact that I didn't say 'terrorist' should be hint enough about my sensibilities). Lastly, you want radical ideas? Go restore an abandoned building site and if you're full of beans try a whole bioregion or a village; if you wanna be more than token symbolically seeknevercant. You may find some daze cryp shuns sprinkled throughout the 37Mb adress below of how to handle /treat / utilize concrete-n-asphalt chunks in a such a (radical) manner here: (this adress).   ----- So, yall think that was controversial do ya? Hang on lemme trump meself here for a while: multiculturalism goes awry more often than not you left leaning correctionalists! Look at dogs for god's sake. What has breeding done for them? I see diametrically opposite results to the ones  Stephen Budiansy distills this conclusion from: Dogs got us exactly where they want us.  Sure, they are playful and cute beyond any sort of useful stage but the price of disfunctionality and decrepitude (that) the various specialisms have led (and lead) to is making Vondel park and surrounds look like a madhouse more than anything (and where is the king of hearts when you need him). PS: SB was featured in a recent Elsevier Magazine issue. Does everything result in pyramid shaped shake outs
(far and few between exceptional excellence isolated by the sheer magnitude of immodestly un- and disallowance makers unless you stick their tips together)?????? 

Or, how's about describing books like Bible and the Koran as real neither here nor there mutty amalgams (full of contrast, contradiction, nuance relativity and names names names ((early conspiracy theory)), which end up paradoxically enough, as preferred prey for fanatics who can always dislodge a passage from context and intended meaning). I dread the prospect for any good work going/reaching/taken mainstream. Did y'all know a load of folks here in Holland were not delivered a magazine (most paperrouters are Arab) cause that was a 'blasphemous place for their holy book to be featured????? Are these idiots trying to get themselves thrown out of the country in solidarity with the undoubtely hard put upon confreres over 'state' side???  A funny and waaaaay too intelligent guy (Haselhoef) is not allowed to speak on behalf of them (being a bit of a mut himself, mutterifucked, he even got fired from his 'soulcare' job in a loony bin cause he did a few times though his rainbow-like take on representation should have made it impossible to fault him on it ) even though he voiced the various fanaticisms amongst assorted adherents as easily as his own winks and speaks very good Dutch(albeit with restrained breathing).


mellow click road service rings true triple a (english) by piet 11:47am Mon Nov 12 '01 sounds rite trip la non --- yeah, Bobberboy should go over to the 'pinkswastika' site (excerpt in a recent /print-resource-friendly-reads2.htm addition) and give us a break. ----- Complexity/viability barely starts at 3 or 4, it takes a region and some lifetimes of serious service, re- and pre 'pear' to do it justice. As for readability: Use of colours can actually simplify and aid understanding (offering a staggerment as it were) in that one can start to read a sentence through sticking with the inital colour the first time around and then adding the differently coloured parenthetical gracenotes) to the desired/stomachable degree one has time and patience for. ----- I feel like Gravity's strainbelow slobthrob; every time I mention dogs (can't always help it being one) some godawfool thing haps. Ps: I forgot to mention that Haselhoef calls himself imampje (liddel imam; the debate raged about his qualifications) and that he is merely 'suspended' which can be taken as given a well deserved rest of course. Compared to most he seems like a priceless Muslim to me. He gained notoriety by uttering Jerry Fallwell-like sentences (the bible calls for death to the buggerer also) alongside flippant interpretations. He sits prim and pretty and is, despite overdone restraint, not nearly as scary as a martial Muslim who sweats his laps in the park with such devastatingly hatefull grimaces and occasional battle cries one wonders a coalition of upset toddler's mothers hasn't formed yet. ------ correction (english) by piet 12:00pm Mon Nov 12 '01 They gave the above suggested (but barely in bud let alone prospective) self policing policy a chance of 2 whole days before reaching the arguable justifiable conclusion that the vast majority was complicit, offered shelter, subterfuge, cover and condonement for the BB's in principle terrorist actions.

88512 an item about arab attire worn by SF women in solidarity; I go: how many pyramids fit into a kaaba? and how many dust-specks into a full (arabian) head of hair unless you wear your dust-cloth whateverchamadamcallit? and are the latter harbingers of the formers in the west or just early practice/old habit ward-offers? Had enough? OK, one more: how many shady spots does one have to dodge on the way from Giza to Kaaba; paternalistic hard making chickenshits in the desert vs wetting ways of eggs for balls seam anew, sow a now stray a nearrow.

88286 individual anarchist is back in grace; he gets 37 comments to a post about a schoolgirl in trouble for wearing anti-war T-shirt  ------ lemme give you an example of the typical counterposition cant and cabal: someone obviously in favor of censorship asks if it should be allowed to wear something saying 'kill all jews' and is in turn asked how she can compare violence to non-violence, etc, etc, ad infinitum  - - - - - are all dogma's jostling for a win on points position preferable to church mode bugger line up???? YES!!!!!


90807: Here is what look like a faithful mirror of this site at first glance.  by piet 11:49am Fri Nov 16 '01   Prime candidate to be linked along in the little grey bar that says 'imc news wire': Italians doing a pic-perf mirror (except for the colours.   Just googled it up. Oh, the joys found upon havin a go ogglin yaself.   ------- 1st impressions  by Carbarne Hammerschlob  4:14pm Fri Nov 16 '01   uhhhhh..... ya think maybe you could post one in english? ------------- 91120 FRONTPAGE WIRE MIRROR (with translation to Italian a click away) about the funcup yesterdee.  They do do mirrors but don't even list this one on that page cause the translation is the piece de resistance here I suspect. ------hi, back again; ai, painful, I fucked up with the url, here is the right one: I guess what they do is keep the front page mirrored and damn well near enough real posting freshness too! But they don't go for the newswire pages at all so: FRONTPAGE WIRE MIRROR AND TRANSLATION (to Italian)  they also have the latest comments on Z-net translated into Italian (but the links to the original files don't work from here). Geezz, Z-net has all of 5 pen-pals in Holland. I could be sixth ------- The other mirrors they do ( ../mirrors.html; 4 of them) are (shit, they got this page locked can't select text on it): Phrack,, and Kriptonite. ----- So there you are, here you go, the frontpage here is the last thing that needs to be mirrored (accesibility-wise) but the translation engine will probably be the main feature for Italosisses and bro's no?
History of Shit

 Dominique Laporte   Written in Paris after the heady days of student revolt in May 1968 and  before the devastation of the AIDS epidemic, History of Shit is emblematic of a wild and adventurous strain of 1970s' theorerical writing that attempted to marry theory, politics, sexuality, pleasure, experimentation, and humor. - ps (may 07): In indy17 i quote from

91204  nettime 'overheavals' (on Baudrillard and Zizek)  by piet 7:43am Sat Nov 17 '01  David Teh B exegesis:  /nettime-bold-0111/msg00334.html (00338 holds the second part) Zizek interview (not pastaposted here):  /articles/00000002D2C4.htm To: Subject: [Nettime-bold] Baudrillard & the Political Economy of Death I From: David Teh Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2001 13:23:00 +1100 Organization: University of Sydney Reply-To: ------ dear thanks to Brian for his Baudrillard translation - i thought this would be an appropriate time to post my writings on S11, (written in early October) which pursue the logic of Death elaborated in "L'Echange Symbolique et la Mort" (1976). i've split it into 2 parts. dt >>>>> *S11 and the Political Economy of Death* “The ease of dying: such would be the danger watching over us … that, in any life, shields us from death …” [Maurice Blanchot, “The Ease of Dying” in l’Amitié, 1971] The Political Economy of Death: on the famous Terrorism of September 11 Today, the War is once again mediated, like past wars – death and the dead have been edited out. The Gulf War was rated PG – parental guidance was recommended, but only for the sake of shoring up the infrastructure of suspicion, fear and hatred, which, like charity, begin at home. If its 100 000 dead had not been so meticulously exiled from the screen, the Gulf War would have been rated X. As it turned out, it was more or less suitable for a General Audience. Sanitised by the screen and its graphical science, the viewing public was treated to everything – the strategic maps, the reconnaissance imagery, the target zone and highlighted target, before and after – right up to the moment of impact, the fiery consummation, the climactic explosion. But Death was nowhere to be seen. The Death card was held close to the chest. This time things are different: this time we started with the explosion, and this time the Death card was turned up first, and once played, it demanded to be exchanged and made to circulate. The immediate source of this death was America’s Eastern seaboard, even though the market (or theatre?) of death was opening much wider, even globally. What distinguishes this global event from the last is the very immediacy (that is, the unmediated nature) of the opening/overture, confirming as it did both the reality of television and the tele-visuality of the real. Not only was the western audience finally able to identify with victims of disaster, of this destruction so graphic, disseminated in such a blanket – even more important is the mediation itself: the domestic technology of imaging the disaster ensured that the image of Death was understood perfectly everywhere, even if it was not ‘believed’. The arrogance of the operation’s timings confirms this. A thousand fascinated cameras made certain there would be a rupture in the screenic fabric of the public sphere, in the first hours, before the media corps had been properly mobilised. Little breaches, like bodies hurling themselves from the WTC towers, an important glimpse into the theatre of Death, like Medusa’s eyes… Once aroused, the economy and exchange of Death could not be stopped. But even now that the long program of reprisals has begun and we have returned to the simulated war (war the whole family can enjoy) – even now that Death has been exiled once again, its secretion and exchange metred as carefully as capital or power – still the symbolic economy of Death cannot be fully controlled. Death Awakens "One cannot treat the gift … without treating [its] relation to economy, even to the money economy. But is not the gift … also that which interrupts economy? That which, in suspending economic calculation, no longer gives rise to exchange? That which opens the circle so as to defy reciprocity or symmetry, the common measure…? … It must not circulate, it must not be exchanged, it must not in any case be exhausted." (Derrida)[1] In the wake of tragedy, confusion reigns, if only briefly. The institution of a new world order plunges all into uncertainty, as the arrogant disregard for life brings everywhere a regard for Death. What is certain, however, is that the acts of September 11 have resuscitated a political economy of Death. It must be remembered that, like all political economy, what this describes is not some firm, material order or knowledge. Rather, what it describes is social relations and power relations. Political economy offers neither truth nor certainty about how any ‘object’ is – it only charts the changing relations between subjects. Contrary to popular belief, political economy has never explored purely economic relations – this the great insight of Marx: that the relations that were the object of political economy, including those that could be described in economic terms, expressed first and foremost social relations. Political economy, then, is a history which chronicles how one subject relates to another. A political economy of death, therefore, charts how one’s death relates to the other, and to the death of the other. Some have argued that the trajectory of “civilization”, and its attendant notion of ‘progress’, is a historic program of the radical exclusion and extradition from society of the Dead, of Death, and of other types of ‘Other’. Allow us to pursue this proposition for a moment: If the extradition of Death from our cities and minds describes our civilization, then on September 11, Death came home to roost. On that day, Death returned from exile, it returned to ‘currency’, in social exchange. (But this was not just any Death, and nor was it just another home-coming. It was not the routine Death which most of us know, and from which we think we flee, day-in and day-out. This quotidian death also haunts us, scares us and defies us; despite our best efforts to shut it out, ignore it and extradite it, even from its exile it haunts us. But S11’s was no ordinary, everyday death. The Death which took to the streets of Manhattan was not the loss of life, but the radical waste of life – needless death, wanton death, wasteful death. Excessive death, luxuriant and abundant death, porno death, death in stereo.) Death’s desublimated return from exile will be the psychic return, metred, return as the “danger”, the “ease of dying” which must return to the everyday in order for this act to be properly successful terrorism. We must return to the skies to know how easily we might have died, how easily we might now die, how easily we might ever die. We must return to the skies to recall how safe we are, which is to feel how very unsafe we are, and always were. Only thus will we discover the full extent of the terror. Airliners – the Potential Energy of Death. ------ Tu es poudre des pierre (english) by mea twho 9:44am Sat Nov 17 '01 Julius Hensel thought the sun was like an egg ... .so where is the cosmic chicken? 2 quotes from this article that are crucial to prove the ultimate vacuity of partial truth expoundment approaching and alass borrowing from humbler and more imperative implications than a mere acknowledging and ingenuflexion to whatever 'other':  1): "Death came home to roost. On that day, Death returned from exile, it returned to ‘currency’, in social exchange.  2):"So the exile was never geographic, but is itself social, an excommunication." Now have a look at some of the 40Mb site hiding behind the link at the bottom of part 2 and you will understand the brief comments below. .. . . . . . . Welcome back, did you notice an emphasis placed on (to the contrary) very geographic and physical borders between a yea or nay, literally watershed, divide between metabolically phenomenal presence and/or absence thereof (one could argue about the ambiguity/relativity of 'death' too but .. )? And don't let all these philosopher folk lead you astray and distract from that grounding. That's not to deny the value of looking at social relations but feeding them rite is more important methinks.  1): Did you notice the connection I made between currency and rockdust? Keeping that in mind (not that it was meant) would allow this formula to semi-stand. 2): blatant denial that the failure to deal with ('embeddiment' in) death not feeding on but nursing and standing guard and holding most patient watch at and as the root of life is the cause of being faced with skewy-screwy types some rung up the higher arcy of complex-iffy-caution. ------- More Baudrillard on terrorism? (english) by piet 10:44am Sat Nov 17 '01 -- I used to argue the uselessness of the guy with a neigbour doing his thesis on the Frencheyes so maybe I am doing him . . . an injustice .. .. .oops no he hates the net.

Anyways, here is more (time awastin obfuscatorily):  Lists-Archives/nettime-bold-0111/msg00576.html (pretty long sin of a butch ((which lives in one of my prfr too)) in the middle of which occurs this): "The perfect mastery of this secretiveness is almost as terrorist as the spectacular action of the 11 September." ----- Well, hell, all secretiveness is by definition terrorism just as all shut up tight rock is terrarist Hahhahahah!!!! " ..tremulous and tenuous social" indeed ".. .base no economy thereon .. " for sure (that last 'quote' from part 1 above here). ------- Also: "Deregulation ends in maximal constraints and restrictions, equal to those in a fundamentalist society." --- Well, once more, can we 'deregulate' some rock now, free some dust and ourselves, achieve the opposite effect please? attribution to that last link (english) by piet 10:50am Sat Nov 17 '01 wa.exe?A2=ind0111&L=cyber- society-live&F=&S=&P=6436 Find my translation of Baudrillard's article attached. It is rather exact (ie I have left in the stylistic repetitions and emphases, even though they sound a bit funny in English). I do not have the time for further polishing now. But if people are interested... Rachel] ==== === ps (may 07): perhaps i should mention that though rock dust making can be and would pretty much best to be done with heavy heavy equipment and that applying it properly is one of the best and most long term measures one can take to further soil conditions conducive to the richer, more demanding, more nourishing varieties of staples and what not, but that another, equally important 'thing' that needs to just about exactly as drasticallly is the soil load 'zumuting'. Mechanization is still upping the weight load on life therein which due to such compaction simply suffocates (no matter how many worms and how many waters work to relieve the stress from this monoculture accompanying torture. Either one of mentioned measures by themselves is only half a one though for either enormous changes in demography would be needed and as difficult to guide as industrialization itself was and is.

92249  Excerpts from and comments on a recent chuckO (who had the dubious honour of becoming a by listmommy for lbo-talk much appreicated poster once he moved away from DC back to Kansas) post (92154). Attempting to put large get togethers together in order to contest large decisions made by few folks representing large but biased contingent in the largest possible but still meaningful context. ---xxxx--- 92154 is a post by ChuckO. I rendered some excerpts in grey,  and interspersed with my responses in this green>> ====  The left has gotten so good at policing itself that it even started marching into the anti-democratic protest pens when the cops started using that tactic.  ----------You mean we are allowed ante-democratic polverization station performance platforms for good and betterin behaviour???? ---------- Let's remember that "civil disobedience" consists of two words. Over the past 30 years, the left forgot about the second word: disobedience. What's more, if you are an American activist, you supposedly live in a "free" country where you have freedom of speech is supposed to be protected. So how did the left get to the point where it cooperated in its own disempowerment? Social change is not going to happen through civil, polite protest.  -------Your emphasis on disobience is just a way to abuse sympathetic momentum and hijack that amorph term to back up your vandalism for horrified awe 'tactic'.  <snip>    Diversity of tactics also recognizes that the tactical situation on the streets during a protest can break down and become fluid. Who could have guessed that "nonviolent activists" in Seattle or Quebec City would throw tear gas canisters back at cops? Who can guess the reaction of black blocers who choose to not resist police attacks?   Another reason why we advocate diversity of tactics is because we see militants and nonviolent activists being attacked by cops without provocation.------ Secrecy is terrorism!  And for god sake stop abusing 'diversity', you know damn well that all violence ever can, does, will and must lead to is polarization, reduction to the black and white stuff, scoured contraction, busts and bursts (I don't mean consensual sex either), repressing the magic theater of multiple greys turning to myriad colours. ------  I've lost track of the number of incidents where the cops attacked a demonstration in order to arrest people wearing masks.  ------ Look, unless the earth starts a crazy wobble sometime soon there can be only one and I mean one radically upright rise up tactic only: Spend your energy on purely passive and 'mere' potential 'frozen' forms thereof (bedrock) so they can start feeding up the relays and ladders of decentralized, bottom up and opened pathways through life/death cycling (photosynthesis).  All the ones you mention contribute to pollution, aggravation and what not.  --------  How come my kind of tactic is excluded, remains unmentioned, not taught let alone practiced? Cause people with less inflammatory impatience than your adherents can't be whipped up into your flavor of militant frenzy?? I often wonder how much growing up by what seems like too many 'bloods of beauties' (quaint and just about antiquated ((not to mention multculturally tabood)) expression in Dutch) for any one man's own good might have to do with your overcompensation on the tough/front count.  -------  How many of you still know that the sound of a child's teeth in a ripe apple is a turn on to a mother and/or motherly's ear? How many less are educated further and deeper along those lines to know crunch of garden destined solarly reducible rock decimated into dust is the most ultimately momsfriendly (for a change) macho yet 'democritterly monstration - vote - measure imaginable? --------- Remick then says that a "tiny group" which embraces these tactics can throw stones from a demonstration that puts everybody else at risk. ----- PreS: I should warn yall that in the passage coming up below this line, i indicate, in hindsight foolishly since most of 'm turned out  all too cryptic for most every first timer, my visions for a rainbow routine, ripened into permacultural commandos and caders, not so much a tough act to depict by standards such as Harry Potter and Lord of the rings got themselves away from it with, but certainly a tough act to follow .. .. .. . That is exactly what happens again and again which is why i reiterate over and over: picking up a stone to be passed along to whereever the most energetic of us wanna make that semi-religious 'destruction at the base of life' semi-Schumpeterian sound with another outward chain giving out resulting fresh-made souvenirs to all and sundry (including police, some of them have gardens and/or parks to visit with kids nearby don't they?).  --------- She continues: "The radical wing of the movement sees enforcing demonstration rules as authoritarian and simply will not accept it. They also reject arguments that the heightened level of polarization and potential for repression creates a new reality post September 11 where promising non-violence is even more important." Needless to say, the movement doesn't divide easily into a radical wing and a non-radical wing. There is a multiplicity of tendencies that overlap and that vary depending on each individual. Many folks like to think that the NGOs are opposed to militant tactics, but one of the secrets of the movement is how they covertly support militant actions that they can't publicly support. -------  Yeah rite, well, we wanna leave those juvenile tactics behind and have the freedom withdraw and grant our support out in the open. A lifeline collonade of hi-tec totin', every Whole Earth catalog trick in the book bearing, volunteer armsful of sustainers, autonomizers and crisis relievers should be FIRST choice and VANGUARD in any (local or international) action seconded by military backup only springing to action when the former is waylaid or harrased in any way. ---------- Chuck: Demonstration rules are, of course, authoritarian. The moderates have frequently lied to the press that they are the primary organizers of an action that has been disrupted by militant outsiders, when the fact is that most of the big anti-globalization protests are the efforts of many groups and coalitions. Demonstration rules are designed to police dissent and discipline it for the interests of some organization.  ---------- Yeah Chuckie you are chuckin' the truer meanings out again by turning a most terrestrially universal verb into a noun (with no fric-frac ties to the faction that fucks with the hard stuff to benefit the very humblest yet most numerous constituents at the bottom of a democritteral pile whose organization is taken for a subjugatorially granted source-pool --- I got news furyall, that's dryin up with all the bravadura goin 'round', The desert(err)s are winnin and the US is fallin headlong into a trap: become (be infected by) that/those you resist. seeya a thousand dodge'ms and seduce'ms later mebbee). Shame on you. Try shift up to principles and forget the hypo-personality cults of whodoolittle dolls. -------- If you call a protest to dispute some temporarily sacralized - momentous - monumentalized spaces you are aiming at a pinprick in time compared to, say, the repair of its weave, net and fabric in an attempted, say, restoration project, which is what we are ultimately wanning to be graduatin' to no? Or are you just havin too much fun fie tin cops? The community movement's or say ecotopia's boosty summer camps don't attain near the popularity the power game does but what counts for all growth does so for political clout as well. Startin small and gettin' your bases 'solid' and sold on you is the only way. Don't give me any fairy tales about needing to stay this course but harder, it don't fool me. Read the summary at the top again. Not the fast boys who want the hard and fast  toys (blind to vastness of costs, the ones that disprove the undeservedly famous line: "Everything treasureable and of great worth is defenseless") since certain ladies will not talk babies before the hard stuff is in the bank: diamonds. Fundamentalists and partriarchs don't like them for this recklessly competitive edge (which is nevertheless universal and much more decisive than environmental effect; compare female competition amongst bees and termites).  ------  What U Have Just Read-New US Torture Tactic -- by The Masses Are Asses 4:08am Mon Nov 19 '01 sodeepitsmeaningless -   For the Love of God, why does your reinforcement of the status quo have to be so painful? Do you think the systematic reduction of educational resources and infrastructure is going to enable the growth of this passive resistance you espouse? Where can I peacefully protest to get the last 5 minutes of my life back? Save the stream of consciousness for the elevators, REM has things covered. ---------- Five minutes indeed lost TMAA, if you consider proposals to mimic the most valuable yet cheap, ubiquitous and inclusive compost ingredient making dreamed up in our PrEvolitionary creation 'passive protest'. ----------- Gee - I like the.... (english) by ArtLover 4:19am Mon Nov 19 '01 ..Original signs and costumes. - I also like the broken-down fences - and the news they have stopped the meeting.- I like the corporate spokesperson who says they agree with the protestors and will make many changes - though I know he is lying!  - I didn't like IKE -when he ran - but in retrospect, I even like him now - compared to all that has followed......- Can we all please unite to stop this D.N.A. identifying stuff; and the concentration work-camps, and the ethnically targeted G.M.O.-"covert" genocides? And stop burning oil, gas, and coal too? And finally de-commission those nuke furnaces, whose radioactive-metals are now being put in childrens' toys, to help with the "new humanitarian" people phase-out methods?  ------------ *puke*   by Wesley Everett 8:01am Mon Nov 19 '01  As I have no idea what this post is attempting to say in its colorful lines of meaningless drivel, I can respond only to the tone and sentiment it portrays. This tone, characteristic of the "Pacifist Fascist" faction is, I think, best answered thus: Fuck you. If you think we're going to arrive at a demonstration of our rejection of plutocratic fascism and then subject ourselves to your brand of  tactical fascism, you are sorely mistaken. The strength of this current uprising, as we must keep pointing out to all the authoritarians in the peanut gallery, is that we have such an enormous diversity within the ranks of dissent. It is not a failure of the milieu that we have no leaders, or central committees, or apparatchiks, or internal police; in fact, it is the absence of these anachronistic hold-overs that has made the milieu so resilient to date. If you wake up one morning to discover that the movementS have become A movement with a leader and an internal gestapo, then you should dress in your best funeral clothes, because the uprising is dead. In the meantime, though, you should - as ChuckO has in the piece that you attempted to quote  above - fight like hell to keep this from happening.  No more bosses anywhere!  --------- Thanks pointin out home I did no know I had  by piet 11:51am Mon Nov 19 '01   If I indeed not only remind you of 'pacifis fascist' (whatever on earth, I never heard of them, any links?)  but actually belong there I must thank you for pointing the way; will do a search by myself tomorrow  if you prove too busy to follow up your own assertions in the mean time.  What gives you the idea I like bosses pray tell?   --------- the next mornin':  additional defense: Ridin home soon after posting the above, my head clearing, I realized waht probably made you associate my piece with bossing; the reference to only one way (is) upright (not one up rite nor at gravity anomalous locales). I beg you to instead associate it with the radii of a sphere (all 'upright' yet together pointin everywhich way), close packing and that sorta contact diversifying such spacing allows. Think also of the all this exemplarily ample examplifying species known as trees, our perhaps greatest benefactor ever and evermore. OK, I am now (checking this URL I was delighted to see they have branched out literally and figuratively ((always best)): and  - Venerable trees of the earth: ----- Here is a follow up on my promise: Don't leave me hanging like that again OK? I may be enigmatic and ridiculously riddly sometimes but I am not the only ones who's behaviour shows what that person don't like to be presented with as much. A teacher don't like to be lectured cause then he is not only not walking his talk but has to shut up even. Ps: first google page reveals one citation with the phrase 'pacifist fascist: (involving convolutions of Hitchens and The Nation --- reams and reams of gossip) Here is the conclusion: I stood in line, figuring out how to ask politely.  I did it.  She kind of chuckled and said “what did he say?”  I said “he said the Nation was the lying servant of power.”  She chuckled again and said “You’ll have to ask him about that.  Everywhere I go people ask me `Why did Christopher say this?  Why did Christopher say that?’”.   And, then she suggested I go see his Nation event on Sunday.  (Strange how Cooper, who announced all of the Nation events for the weekend, didn’t announce Snitch’s). That wasn’t enough.  Still trying to be polite, I asked “Well, how do you feel about that?  Personally?”.   She said “I feel really bad about it…. You should ask him about it on Sunday.” Maybe I will, although I think I need some reinforcements.  I’m scared that pacifist fascist will punch me if I tell people that Larry Klayman pays his salary.  Anyone from the Los Angeles area want to join me on Sunday? Anyway, I didn’t bring The Nation down.  Or get any answers.  But, I did have an enjoyable evening with a witty woman. The moral of this story? No idea.  I’m just trying to get up the nerve to go head-to-head with the Snitch.  I’ll report back on Monday.   --Atrios ----  The greatest weapon of the fascist, Is the tolerance of the pacifist. Sariel's mailsig  ---- the matter. 2. Fascist. There are pacifist fascist groups which are pretty peaceful and harmless, but most people would never understand that. 3. Communist. I ... - 13k - -------- John Shelley's Journal... be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. Hey, pacifist fascist filth: you're either with us or you're against America. Read Mike ... - 34k -   Related: On the evils of pacifism: via: (resembles slash)

91610 conspiracy item (+10).  fabulation story spanning beyond the solar system; this morning a thought occured to me: Tall tales distract from horrors closer by and up, inspire fears and awes of as well as hopes projected into distant times and spaces; displacement ever was a primary of curiosity (neugier = neue gier = new greed) diffision, trade and migration pursued with passion. Place your teufelskreis (viciously circular) fluke and failure finessing faulty habits fueling bets on transience and transcendence here.

92314 Chomsky criticism by Jeffrey C Isaac; I add (as last commenter; the handful of preceding ones in the tuesday.htm prfr): by piet 11:40am Mon Nov 19 '01 So, myT perspicacious of mr Isaac to note the cynicism if that is what he insists on calling it. I  wouldn't and suspect the pure passivity and patience required for meticulous and painstaking analysis is such a greatly focussed on talent with our champ Chumps that the solution department is left to speak for itself, well that is what I at least feel to be here for so here goes:  I can go along with mr Isaac better in not quite equating shrewd violence and fanatic violence but  must side with Chomski on the other hand in finding that they both are persuasive in a deadly manner (not to mention that they come in too many forms to enumerate). A large difference I see between C and I is their net-presence. I can't quickly find any Isaac texts on line. Not part of what he sees as a solution I guess, or does he not see any (either)?

92308 On the trouble in Zimbabwe; I add: by piet 9:53am Mon Nov 19 '01 - which is the softest way to subsidize it. Barring life threatening situations, an offered equivalent and par asset transferral and exchange I doubt not the whites and many Afro-Americans would allow hopes for more congenial environments to tip the scale no? To avoid flack over racially flavored 'exchange rates' volunteer candidates with comparable wealth should be chosen initally but wealth poolers should be allowed to join ranks as well. Then again, assuming Afro-whities' needs are greatest
                    I don't know how that should figure.  -----posted this twice. The second time at an item (92300) called: "Don't play the race card" I said: "I don't like the title one bit"  by piet 9:59am Mon Nov 19 '01  Even granted all this is true (haven't even read it all), your title is insanely unrealistic enough to respond to even that alone. Do you know what is going on in Zimbabwe? I just commented this on 92308 (concerning trouble there): Facilitate repatriation . . .(which) is the softest way to subsidize it. Barring life threatening situations, an offered equivalent and par asset transferral and exchange. I doubt not the whites and many Afro-Americans would allow hopes for more congenial environments to tip the scale no?  To avoid flack over racially flavored 'exchange rates' volunteer candidates  with comparable wealth should be chosen initally but wealth poolers should be allowed to join ranks as well. Then again, assuming Afro-whities' needs are greatest.  I don't know how that should figure.  -------- good piece bad title. -- by piet 10:19am Mon Nov 19 '01 Ok, read the whole thing now and liked it, I still think you should play with a full deck at all times; cheat with none of the cards nor leave any out.  Here is a line I messed up redone:  Barring life threatening situations, when (upon being) offered equivalent and par asset  transferral and exchange I doubt not the whites and many Afro-Americans would allow hopes for more congenial environments to tip the scale in favor of relocation do you?

92416 Wonderful site is no more by piet 11:21am Mon Nov 19 '01 one of the few places that linked to my site around the net has folded: used to carry heady (black n white) art;  If you care to salvage a wide ranging linklist see the article wherein I posted the 99K   cached google version for yall.   Once google don't 'stock' it anymore yall can come over here for it: Sisyphus.htm  the categories (white text on black field):  databases & search engines - (mis)organized sound - bands and musicians - labels - libraries and booksellers -  booksellers & book searches - free online texts - creative, critical, clinical theory - literary/small press - artists books   publishing tools - academic publishers - art & design instruction - literature?    indie ezines - indie film and video - indie film distributors - radical theater and bodywork   destroying capitalism from within (an)aesthetic organizations - medicine and technology - agroforestry and food - computing applications - unsorted (but important) - desiderata Ps: watch the space: ' for revival.

I will be using 'Beckerath on peacemaking' as filler soon to make up an even number of pages